----- Original Message -----

I paid a visit to The Railway Age earlier today to rescue some seats from the APT-P, I got two 1st Class seats & my friend also got two so we managed to save four seats from the scrapman. I've attached a few of pics I took whilst there & I'll upload the rest to my Fotopic site later:

 

http://AA-Rail-Pics.fotopic.net

>....They don't want to scrap the train, far from it, they want to make it

>
> Andy,
>
> >....They don't want to scrap the train, far from it, they want to

> a big attendance puller....<
>
> I applaud the sentiment they display, but why try and do this while

> same time preventing Rob's group from helping out?
>
> The group probably know more about P-Train than any body of people

> and yet they are almost phyiscally prevented from access to the

> we've found with E-Train, having people working on the vehicles

> intentions but zero knowledge can not only be non-productive but

> downright dangerous. At York two of the NRM fitters removed the

> two of the Power Car tilt jacks, despite large red signs suggesting

> was dangerous, and then complained when the vehicle fell over

> of them!!!!!
>
> I'll watch the activities at TRA with high hopes but I don't have

> confidence that the stated aims will be realised I'm afraid.
>
> Regards
> Kit
>

If you want the train to be a attention puller then why not turn it into a museum itself.  Turn the empty car into a attraction telling the whole story of the APT project from POP train to the Virgin Pendalino, have films, models of POP train, E train, tilt machinary and how the train would have looked in its different forms and liveries had it been a success, as well as photos, drawings, memrabelia from designs to postcards, as the people then walk through the train they will see the buffet car, the driving car, and the final two cars should be an expierence of a ride on the APT with a film and the cars tilting the journey being shown on TV screens, finally you leave through the drivers cab where you can take photos.

They do this at Brooklands on concorde and are charging £5.00 for a visit.  if you do this you could make more money than a "party car" and disposing of the seats would be worth while as after all P train will never travel or carry passengers again, but we should show her and E train off as they are the first tilting trains at hold records on british railways.

Just a thought

Brian 

----- Original Message -----
From: <brian@...>


> If you want the train to be a attention puller then why not turn it into
> a museum itself.

Food for thought, but the key sentence is this one:

> after all P train will never travel or carry passengers again

Does anyone - on or off the group - harbour a hope that a P-train might run
one day?
Because if some do and some don't, it may be harder to unite behind a plan.

David 1/2d
Mechanical Design Section





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>....Does anyone - on or off the group - harbour a hope that a P-train

----- Original Message -----
From: "Kit Spackman" <101453.3657@...>
>
>>....Does anyone - on or off the group - harbour a hope that a P-train
> might run one day?<
>
> Some obviously do. It's a question that returns time after time. There
> are
> even some who would like E-Train to run again.....
>
> I just don't think there's enough money available to even think
> about doing it, let alone solving the difficulties of getting any sort of
> railway administration to agree to the idea.
>

Thanks Kit.

Even it there were enough money, we would also need a substantial team with
the right skills, and enough documentation to understand what needed doing
and why.

And our Sponsor's agenda might be different.

David





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I personally would love to see both e and p trains running again, but the only way to do this would be to have a private track like the steam lines have, this would cost a fortune and after all that happened in the 80's would there be enough interest from the public to warrent this as a venture, hence I feel that for the P train to survive and make money for its up keep the idea of turning it into a bigger exhibit showing its history from the drawing board to the pendelino showing how advanced the technology in these older trains was and still is way ahead of its time
and without this train the new versions would most likely not exsist in the way that they do today.  I am not saying destroy any hopes for the trains ever running again but before there is ever a chance of them running raise their profiles and change the attitudes towards them from the general public, then who knows a millionare might help to get them running on the british tracks again, but I think this is slim, after all the Orient Express has had its fair share of troubles fitting in its trips around the timetables of british rail and a like.

I would like to see concorde back in the skies, I do not see this happening either.  Better the trains are in museums with groups like these caring for them than on a scrap heap!  Lets make the most out of the situation these trains are in.  

----- Original Message -----
From: <brian@...>

> and without this train the new versions would most likely not exist in
> the way that they do today.

Without the APT project, the Fiat Pendolino would have gone ahead anyway.
But unless somebody in Italy had spotted its fatal design flaw (tilt pivot
above lateral suspension), it would have crashed on its first test run.

David 1/2d





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----- Original Message -----

>I would love the APT-P to run again, but im not sure if im very
> comfortable with the seats being removed and sold. I mean, if we want
> the APT-P to go again, we need seats, unless we are making it to a
> buffet carriage!
> Well, lets hope TRA took the address and names of those who bought
> seats...
>
> Damon.

> I have "preserved" two reclining First Class seats & a friend of mine has
> done the same, however, I don't think the local scrap man will be too
> bothered about the seats he receives :-(
>
> I would have taken the lot but lack of space has prevented this. When I
> posted the info the other week I was hoping a few more members would have
> saved some seats too but it looks like the majority haven't for one reason
> or another - please prove me wrong!
>
> Just out of curiosity, how many other members have purchased seats from the
> APT-P ? (you can contact me off-group if you wish).

>....back in 2002 I took some shots of APT-E and APT-P together in trainsim

>time didn't know how to setup automatically drive trains so they were just

>for the one I was driving) See -

>http://www.apt-p.com/MSTS.htm<

>Perhaps I really should release my P Train cabview ?? (If I can
>remember how to!!)<

>
> Sorry to drag this up again but is there any news on the drawings?
>
> I have my project on hold as it looked like i might be able to get

> hands on some first rate reaserch material but since then i have
> heard nothing.
>
> am i to asume that this was just a red herring? did the reported
> drawings really exist?
>
> I am after properly dimensioned drawings of the front end showing

> radiuses and angles. also any propper (not just simple magazine
> sketches) drawings of the hatches and underframe detail.
>
> I know many of you would like a model but if things like this dont
> come to light then it just isnt going to happen.
> AutoCAD wont accept me telling it "well it looked like it was about
> this much" (holding my hands a distance of about 1 foot apart!) i
> have to put in numbers. those numbers would be fantastically
> compicated to glean from the real thing. if i can get my hands on
> some propper data then it makes my life a hell of a lot easier.
>
> Peter
>

>I am looking forward to the lecture and to finally putting a face to
>the name. <

>(if you have a few minutes earlier in the day would you
>possibly have time to cast your eye over the etching artwork i have
>done so far?)<

----- Original Message -----
From: "Kit Spackman" <101453.3657@...>

> BIG hair was the order of the day back
then. I did think about wearing my Inspector's Coat for the lecture but it
> could be a bit bulky........

Yeah, you looked like a golliwog in a cornflakes box ;-)

> Anyone else from the Group likely to be there?

Hope to get to one of the repeat performances Kit.

David 1/2d

>
> Sorry to drag this up again but is there any news on the drawings?
>
> I have my project on hold as it looked like i might be able to get

> hands on some first rate reaserch material but since then i have
> heard nothing.
>
> am i to asume that this was just a red herring? did the reported
> drawings really exist?
>
> I am after properly dimensioned drawings of the front end showing

> radiuses and angles. also any propper (not just simple magazine
> sketches) drawings of the hatches and underframe detail.
>
> I know many of you would like a model but if things like this dont
> come to light then it just isnt going to happen.
> AutoCAD wont accept me telling it "well it looked like it was about
> this much" (holding my hands a distance of about 1 foot apart!) i
> have to put in numbers. those numbers would be fantastically
> compicated to glean from the real thing. if i can get my hands on
> some propper data then it makes my life a hell of a lot easier.
>
> Peter
>

----- Original Message -----

From: Kit Spackman

To: APT Yahoo Group

Sent: Wednesday, August 08, 2007 9:32 PM

Subject: <APT Group> Kit's APT Show...

For those real masochists amongst you, I've firmed up a date for one of my
APT lectures later on this year.

This one will be in London on Thursday October 11th at Keen House, the HQ
of The Model Railway Club nr Kings Cross. I don't have a firm time frame
for it yet, but I guess it will start around 7.0 pm or so. I'll be doing
the 'short version' ('only' 104 slides instead of the long version's 116)
so it should last around 2 hrs or so, but that's minus question time, which
on occasion has gone on for over an hour at some venues!

If you haven't heard of this mad event, it's a lecture with slides
(Powerpoint these days) or a slide show with vocal captions by me, covering
the history of the APT project from my own decidely 'slanted' point of view
<g> It's quite definitely aligned with the engineering and humerous side of
the project, and only slightly covers the political and financial areas.
Bring some tissue hankies with you because if I don't have the audience in
hysterical laughter at least a few times I'll consider I've failed...... ..

I'll be doing it again in Lichfield, just north of Brum, some time late in
2008, but there are no firm dates as yet. Who knows, maybe other occasions
between then and now, considering I'll be retiring on April 1st next year
I'l have more free time after then.

Regards
Kit

>hi kit can you give me some directions for the show? were do i go when i

>
> http://books.google.com/books?

>