Thanks Alan,

A superb bit of footage showing a high speed APT-P !!!

Kindest regards,
Andy

----- Original Message -----


> Another (not mine):
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=joeRI043fqs

Neat that, the second one being particularly real looking.

The first one seemed to have a lack of hydraulic power for it's tilt system
<g> and the second one had a tilt failure on the penultimate car.
Interestingly that was a 3+2+5 as far as I could see, almost a model
version of the opening day consist. (That was 2+2+6 I think)

Regards
Kit

Interesting:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0mlE5dA5z_g

Two APT's side-by-side, one of which is moving! David Rollin can be
heard in the files section on the BBC Railwatch audio clip.

VERY! Cheers Alan.

Andy

----- Original Message -----

Interesting:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0mlE5dA5z_g

Kit Spackman wrote:

> Neat that, the second one being particularly real looking.
>
> The first one seemed to have a lack of hydraulic power for it's tilt system
> <g> and the second one had a tilt failure on the penultimate car.
> Interestingly that was a 3+2+5 as far as I could see, almost a model
> version of the opening day consist. (That was 2+2+6 I think)

A judicious use of the pause button reveals the model is formed as 2+2+4
- DTS+TBF+NDM+NDM+TBF+TBF+TBF+DTS. A very crafty way to arrange the cars
in two hornby sets to build a single 8 car set, but he hasn't made up
the intermediate vehicles by cutting a DTS and a TBF into one vehicle in
the way some people have. I also note that there is only catenary over
the near side track, not the one the APT was travelling on...

James Moody
--
aka: Major Denis Bloodnok | (¯\
ICQ: 7000473 | \ \ /¯)
http://www.vsr.org.uk | \ \___/ /
No more can they keep us in | |/ _)| )
Listen, damn it, we will win | ( (|_| )
They see it right, they see it well | \ /
But they think this saves us from our hell | |====|

Further to some prior debate on whether P and E train ever passed, I recall some photos of
APT-P going through Eaglescliffe pulled by a Class 37. In the same period I am sure E train
was adjacent to the ECML under some taurpaullins (I remember going past it on the IC 125
service from York to Darlington). Question is, where was P train going to/from via
Eaglescliffe and if it went through York it surely must have been pulled past E-train?

Simon

Hi,
E and P train passing, well........................................

E train was still in the NRM car park in 1979/1980 and the York Brel
works where having an open day, an APT-P set was brought up to be
placed on display in the York Yard, as far as I can tell, they
brought a P train up from Derby works and its just possible it came
through York station, my brother lived in a house looking into the
station and seems to remember P train going through heading north in
the early hours hauld my a class 47. If this is the case, the two
will have met just north of York station. Would have made a great
shot, apart from it being dark, oh well.

If any one work for Brel York at that time, maybe you could shed some
light on this subject.

Regards

Paul

--- In Advanced-Passenger-Train@yahoogroups.com, "Simon Argyle"
<simonargyle@...> wrote:

>
> Further to some prior debate on whether P and E train ever passed,

I recall some photos of

> APT-P going through Eaglescliffe pulled by a Class 37. In the same

period I am sure E train

> was adjacent to the ECML under some taurpaullins (I remember going

past it on the IC 125

> service from York to Darlington). Question is, where was P train

going to/from via

> Eaglescliffe and if it went through York it surely must have been

pulled past E-train?

>
> Simon
>

In the days when E-Train was in the sidings under that awful tarpaulin it
was only PC1-TC1-PC2 of course. TC2 was in the Great Hall either tiltinng
happily away or classed as a public hazard by the HSE spoilsports......

Which reminds me, we really MUST talk to Anthony about how we are going to
re-tilt one of the vehicles safely. There MUST be a a way to do it, Joe
Public expects it to happen!

Regards
Kit

Hi Kit,
Lets nip into the NRM warehouse and get TC2's tilt pack, as its still
full of oil, im sure a few mins of TLC from you will have to up and
running in no time.

Maybe we should take a leaf from Mr Pennys book, just do it anyway!!!

Regards

Paul

Not 100% APT related but still of interest to the group (info from "Trains-Gen") ......

Just been announced that Metronet is to take over Old Dalby test track.

It will be given 4km of 3Rd and 4th rail and be used to test new Underground stock being built in Derby by Bombardier, who are part of Metronet consortium.

Whether 25kv is staying unknown at present.
----------

Ta to Trains-Gen / BluePullman

Well, track down and being able to run is far better than losing this
important railway testing advantage.

--- In Advanced-Passenger-Train@yahoogroups.com, "Andy Appleton
(BlackBerry)" <AndyAppleton@...> wrote:

>
> Not 100% APT related but still of interest to the group (info

from "Trains-Gen") ......

>
> Just been announced that Metronet is to take over Old Dalby test

track.

>
> It will be given 4km of 3Rd and 4th rail and be used to test new

Underground stock being built in Derby by Bombardier, who are part of
Metronet consortium.

>
> Whether 25kv is staying unknown at present.
> ----------
>
> Ta to Trains-Gen / BluePullman
>

It has been reported (21:10) that a Virgin Pendolino has crashed in
Cumbria:

"The collision is believed to have taken place at Greyrigg Cottage in
the Lake District between Oxenholme and Tebay."

Train is the 17:15 Euston to Glasgow Central. The whole train has been
derailed and at least some of the coaches have gone down the
embankment into a field. Air ambulances are present. About 210
passengers on board. Further information on the BBC news website -
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/6391633.stm

Stephen

--- In Advanced-Passenger-Train@yahoogroups.com, "Alan" <yahoo@...>
wrote:

>
> It has been reported (21:10) that a Virgin Pendolino has crashed in
> Cumbria:
>
> "The collision is believed to have taken place at Greyrigg Cottage

in

> the Lake District between Oxenholme and Tebay."
>

Maybe not get carried away. The reports are changing constantly at the
moment.

Stuart

-----Original Message-----
From: Advanced-Passenger-Train@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:Advanced-Passenger-Train@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of
stephenatcarlisle
Sent: 23 February 2007 22:08
To: Advanced-Passenger-Train@yahoogroups.com
Subject: <APT Group> Re: Pendolino Crash


Train is the 17:15 Euston to Glasgow Central. The whole train has been
derailed and at least some of the coaches have gone down the
embankment into a field. Air ambulances are present. About 210
passengers on board. Further information on the BBC news website -
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/6391633.stm

Stephen

--- In Advanced-Passenger-Train@yahoogroups.com, "Alan" <yahoo@...>
wrote:

>
> It has been reported (21:10) that a Virgin Pendolino has crashed in
> Cumbria:
>
> "The collision is believed to have taken place at Greyrigg Cottage

in

> the Lake District between Oxenholme and Tebay."
>

Yahoo! Groups - Join or create groups, clubs, forums & communities.
Links

---

What kind of emailer are you? Find out today - get a free analysis of your email personality. Take the quiz at the Yahoo! Mail Championship.

Oh dear - the BBC's "Railway Expert" has stated that "the Pendolino is
Britain's first tilting train".

Where do they get these "experts" from?

my pal's dad works for network in the Glasgow area and he got a
phone call from his boss at about 9:30pm telling him what and asking
him to drive to down the accident as he's one of the senior network
rail staff in the Glasgow area. I think this is because if I
remember correctly Glasgow covers down to Manchester now with
network rail.

Any particular reason why Gerry?

David 1/2d

>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Gerry Bates" <gerry@...>
>> To: <Advanced-Passenger-Train@yahoogroups.com>
>> Sent: Tuesday, February 27, 2007 11:51 PM
>> Subject: <APT Group> Electrification petition
>>
>>
>> Dear All
>>
>> Could I urge you all to sign Roger Ford's petition in favour of further
>> railway electrification at http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/Electrify/
>>
>> Regards
>>
>> Gerry Bates
>>

Hi
Not sure whther this is the correct place to ask so apologies if not.
I have been viewing documents at the National Archives in Kew
(primarily looking for info on the Mk3b BFO) I have come across
documents related to the electric HST project. It seems that these
were actually to be classed as class 90 electric locos with numbers
90001-90004 to be allocated.

One of the design briefs is that the locos/power cars were to be used
with APT-U trailers or Mk3 stock. I can't remember whether the APT-U
trailers were to be tilting but it does make me want to know more. I
am wondered how much development work actually took place with the
APT-U trailers and what sort of equipment they would have been
equipped with. As the design spec for the HST-E required them to be
fitted with conventional ETH (rather than the HST variety) and buffers
then I assume that the APT-U would have needed the same equipment. My
gut reaction is that the APT-U trailer 'project' morphed into that of
the MkIV and IC225 for the ECML. I of course need to check out more
documents to either confirm or deny this.

If anybody has any additional info or clarification on this project
then I would be delighted to hear. Knowing which files to look at
specifically would also be a great help. Incidentally the HST-E
project was cancelled as it was felt that there was no longer any need
for it and it would simply serve no purpose - not helped by the
comparative class 89 project being delayed so comparisons between the
types could not take place.

Best wishes
Natalie Jones
http://nataliejones.fpic.co.uk

Hello Natalie,

>Not sure whther this is the correct place to ask so apologies if not.<

I can't think of a better place to ask frankly <g>

>One of the design briefs is that the locos/power cars were to be used
>with APT-U trailers or Mk3 stock. I can't remember whether the APT-U
>trailers were to be tilting but it does make me want to know more.<

They were, all APT stock, built or projected, were to be tilting. The APT-U
trailers were not to be articulated though, unlike
their predecessors, the APT-S trailer cars. They were never built
either.........

The APT-U stock was also not planned to be fitted with HK brakes, but it
doesn't say anywhere what alternative was intended.

>Iam wondered how much development work actually took place with the
>APT-U trailers and what sort of equipment they would have been
>equipped with. <

No development as such took place as they never got beyond the design
stage. Little information is available on the proposed detailed equipment
fit as far as I can see, as you've already discovered.

>My gut reaction is that the APT-U trailer 'project' morphed into that of
>the MkIV and IC225 for the ECML. I of course need to check out more
>documents to either confirm or deny this. <

That's pretty well the case, except that APT-U was to have a power car at
each end, with both pantographs in use, limiting it's maximum speed to 125
mph. The IC225 only had one power car, the Class 90s, but would have run
at 140 mph (225 kph) It would have been traction limited up Shap and
Beattock however, which is presumably why they run on the relatively flat
ECML today.

>Incidentally the HST-E project was cancelled as it was felt that there was

no longer any need

>for it and it would simply serve no purpose - not helped by the

comparative class 89 project being

>delayed so comparisons between the types could not take place.<

The HST(E) would have been considerably less flexible than the Class 89/Mk
IV project as it was a 'one piece' train, whereas the Class 89 could have
been used on freight movements as well. The Mk IVs were designed to be
retro-fitted with tilt systems, using a 'sandwich' between the normal
bogies and the bodies, and the tumble-home to enable that can be seen if
you look along the train compared to a non-tilting Class 90. As far as I
know this was never done, not even on an experimental basis. I'm not even
sure if the required 'sandwiches' were ever built, but the under-floor Mk
IV tilt hydraulic packs from the APT-P trailer cars would have fitted the
similarly shaped bays on the MKIV coaches.

There's quite a bit about the gestation and development (or lack of it....)
on the APT-P, -S, -U and IC225 in Hugh Williams APT 'Bible', pages 102
onwards. Hugh shows diagrams of the various consists and even the HST(E)
gets a mention. Well worth a look.

Regards
Kit

There is a picture of a possible APT derivative in the "Flights of Fancy"
section on my Fotopic site. Roughly similar to the Electric HST idea, I have
portrayed the IC225 as it may have been if designed and built a few years
earlier to the APT design. This can be seen here....
http://www.adamsphotos.fotopic.net/p7719084.html

Some more APT-related fun and games here:

http://www.adamsphotos.fotopic.net/p7834511.html

And here:
http://www.adamsphotos.fotopic.net/p7891263.html

And, indirectly, here:

http://www.adamsphotos.fotopic.net/p20157166.html

Enjoy :-)


Best Regards,
Adam Warr
Peterborough, UK
Website: http://www.electrarailwaygraphics.co.uk
My Blog: http://captainelectra.blogspot.com/


--
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Checked by AVG Free Edition.
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16:09

Hi Kit

Thanks for your reply - much appreciated.

>
> There's quite a bit about the gestation and development (or lack of
> > it....)on the APT-P, -S, -U and IC225 in Hugh Williams APT

'Bible', > > pages 102 onwards. Hugh shows diagrams of the various
consists and > > > even the HST(E)gets a mention. Well worth a look.

I did wonder whether there would be anything in there but for some
reason thought it might be after the publication date... I have said
publication on my shelves not 6 feet away - "reaches for book and
starts to inwardly digest its knowledgeable contents..."

I shall see if I can find anything out however in my next trip to the
Nat Archives which I can thoroughly recommend!! It is soo much better
to do your own research out and find things out from the original
documents and correspondence. Or I am just a little strange? !!

Best wishes
Natalie
nttp://nataliejones.fpic.co.uk

Andy,

>I've just come across a site that contains information about a model

railway exhibition which takes place 17th & 18th March in >Nottingham. One
of the layouts there will include at least one Hornby APT-P set of which a
photo can be seen here:-<

A few years ago there was an OO layout on the exhibition circuit that
majored on R&D Division stock, and included an APT-E which tilted quite
nicely!

They also had 'Ixion' the R&D CLass 45/6, our class 25 and 17, and numerous
lab coaches, but not Hastings Coach. I ran across the layout at Bristol and
I think they came from the Kidderminster or Bromsgrove area. The guy
running it nearly fell off his chair when I told him who I was, and I spent
the next hour filling in gaps in their R&D Div knowledge.

Regards
Kit

> A few years ago there was an OO layout on the exhibition circuit that
> majored on R&D Division stock, and included an APT-E which tilted quite
> nicely!

Hello Kit,

EXCELLENT!! I don't suppose there are any photos on the WWW???

Take care,
Andy

http://AA-Rail-Pics.fotopic.net

--- In Advanced-Passenger-Train@yahoogroups.com, "Adam Warr" <adam.warr@...> wrote:
>
> There is a picture of a possible APT derivative in the "Flights of Fancy"
> section on my Fotopic site.

I like the one at the bottom of here;  

 http://www.therailwaycentre.com/Recognition%20Pictures%20Loco/Artists_loco.html

(First post so hope I haven't trodden on any toes!)

Very possibly Stephen P Jones of Barry and Penarth model railway club,
he has built vast amounts of RTC stock, as well as at least one 14 car
APT-P set, with another one the way. I have forwarded this to him as
well to see if he responds

If anyone does come along to Nottingham come and say hello as I will be
there with my Dagworth layout. Being based on the GE main line I won't
have my P-train running though, it will appear lots on the new layout
http://gingespotting-models.fotopic.net/p28246336.html

Andi

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Advanced-Passenger-Train@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:Advanced-Passenger-Train@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
> Of Kit Spackman
> Sent: 04 March 2007 16:52
> To: APT Yahoo Group
> Subject: <APT Group> Layouts with APTs
>
>
> Andy,
>
> >I've just come across a site that contains information about a model
> railway exhibition which takes place 17th & 18th March in
> >Nottingham. One of the layouts there will include at least
> one Hornby APT-P set of which a photo can be seen here:-<
>
> A few years ago there was an OO layout on the exhibition
> circuit that majored on R&D Division stock, and included an
> APT-E which tilted quite nicely!
>
> They also had 'Ixion' the R&D CLass 45/6, our class 25 and
> 17, and numerous lab coaches, but not Hastings Coach. I ran
> across the layout at Bristol and I think they came from the
> Kidderminster or Bromsgrove area. The guy running it nearly
> fell off his chair when I told him who I was, and I spent the
> next hour filling in gaps in their R&D Div knowledge.
>
> Regards
> Kit
>
>
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
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> Receive up to $1,000 from GFT. Click here to learn more.
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>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------
> ------~->
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>

Hi

 

Andi it was not me, not yet had the pleasure of meeting Kit.

 

Im Guilty of having a 14 APT-P set also its to be 370 004 and 370 002 In the process or painting the Hornby Grey the correct InterCity Grey

 

The next set will be 370 006 and 370 001 with black cab windows and red lining around  the yellow.

 

Have also done a DTS with the front up and a couple of 'what ifs' from left overs live a Driving Van trailer (4 axles) and a power car with a cab on

 

Some pics on Rob's APT-P site in the model section.

 

As for other RTC stock, building up a collection so far have done the The Trib train, Lab 22 and the Soil test train, Lab 5 Prometheus, Lab 23, Lab 2,  Iris 2, Lab 15, Test car 5.

 

Current project is Cyclops, next its POP the later version with the clad sides.

 

My layout, If I ever get on with it is called Slack Lane. The idea is its mainly a RTC type depot with elements from Derby RTC but next to Old Dalby Test track, there is also a limited passenger service that uses a station next to the depot.

 

Stephen p Jones

Great minds... I've got a raft of APTs awaiting the chop at some stage to make up a pair of
14-coachers, although I've been saying I'll get around to it for about 10 years now! I think
the thing putting me off is trying to modify the cabs to look more APT-ish and less Hornby-
huge-wedge-shape-ish.

Being pedantic, did any full length rakes run with the red lining? I always associated that
feature with the last set in traffic (the one preserved at Crewe plus 48101 as a spare DT?)
once it had been reduced to the short rake and the others had been cut. I'm probably wrong!

Owen

--- In Advanced-Passenger-Train@yahoogroups.com, SJones7505@... wrote:
> The next set will be 370 006 and 370 001 with black cab windows and red
> lining around the yellow.

On Mon, 05 Mar 2007 21:07:55 -0000 , "michael8600" <griffin_m_j@...> wrote:

>http://www.therailwaycentre.com/Recognition%20Pictures%20Loco/Artists_lo\
>co.html
><http://www.therailwaycentre.com/Recognition%20Pictures%20Loco/Artists_l\
>oco.html>
>
>(First post so hope I haven't trodden on any toes!)

This is my first post and I've been on here for 6 years :-)

Thanks for that link. I have been searching for Intercity250 pictures for such a long time, I know one of my RAIL magazines has it but I they're stored all over the place. I can at least do a LEGO model of it now. From the body profile it looks non-tilting.

Slightly off-topic but I'm sure people here know, I heard legend that the HST did 176mph when testing the SIG bogies for the Mk4 coaches - is this true? I can't find a record of it anywhere, apart from a 1987 Guinness Book of Records I had as a child but has since been thrown out.

Simon Denscombe

Certainly the set reached 143 mph, but I've not heard of the higher speed. I would imagine it
is a little unlikely, given that APT-P "only" reached 162mph or so on tests, with its advanced
braking systems and all.

For a while HST held the world diesel speed record, though I've heard that some Spanish set
has since beaten this, whether officially or unofficially.

Owen

--- In Advanced-Passenger-Train@yahoogroups.com, Simon Denscombe <carbon60@...>
wrote:

> Slightly off-topic but I'm sure people here know, I heard legend that the HST did 176mph
> when testing the SIG bogies for the Mk4 coaches - is this true? I can't find a record of it
> anywhere, apart from a 1987 Guinness Book of Records I had as a child but has since been
> thrown out.
>
> Simon Denscombe
>

The record for HST was set in November 1987 during tests for the new
Mk.4 coaches and stands at 148.4mph (238kph). I believe this is still
the record for diesel trains recognised in the Guinness Book of World
Records.

*********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********

On 06/03/2007 at 13:30 Simon Denscombe wrote:

Slightly off-topic but I'm sure people here know, I heard legend that the HST did 176mph when testing the SIG bogies for the Mk4 coaches - is this true? I can't find a record of it anywhere, apart from a 1987 Guinness Book of Records I had as a child but has since been thrown out.

Simon Denscombe

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On Tue, 06 Mar 2007 18:54:46 -0000 , "Wayne Marshall" <waynemarshall@...> wrote:

>The record for HST was set in November 1987 during tests for the new
>Mk.4 coaches and stands at 148.4mph (238kph). I believe this is still
>the record for diesel trains recognised in the Guinness Book of World
>Records.

Thanks for that, my mind can now finally be at rest :-)

Has anyone got more pictures of the proposed Intercity 250 train? I intend to model it.

Simon Denscombe

In the current issue (April 07) of The Railway Magazine a letter of support for the APT can be found on page 37:

 

-------

"It is fashionable for some people today to criticise the Advanced Passenger Train, but if only a fraction of the cost of upgrading the West Coast Main Line had been spent on making the APT reliable a quarter of a centaury ago, Britain would probably now be a world leader in tilting trains instead of an importer of other countries' trains."

 

Basil Hancock (New South Wales, Australia).

-------

 

Well said Basil!

 

Andy

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Just another example of lack of vision and spinless leadership from
Whitehall.

--- In Advanced-Passenger-Train@yahoogroups.com, "keelar001"
<keelar@...> wrote:

>
> Just another example of lack of vision and spinless leadership from
> Whitehall.
>

i always thought one of the reasons was that the government of the days
party got donations from the airlines and had shares in the airline
companies as well.

Gerry et al,

>.....and that they and the Mk IV coaches have a profile designed to allow

tilt.<

Mk IVs also had the space under the floor for an APT-P Mk IV tilt pack (the
co-incidence of the Mark Nos. is just that, a co-incidence BTW) and had
provision for a 'tilt actuator' sandwich to go between the bogies and the
underframe. I don't know if any of these 'sandwiches' were actually built
though, or even what they looked like. I'd be interested to know if anyone
else in the Group does.

Regards
Kit

--- In Advanced-Passenger-Train@yahoogroups.com, "keelar001" <keelar@...> wrote:

>
> Just another example of lack of vision and spinless leadership from
> Whitehall.
>

Does the Blue Streak ICBM/launcher and TSR-2 strike aircraft ring any bells here..........mind
you Concorde got through - perhaps we should have joined up with the French on high
speed trains - I am sure their watertight gov/gov agreements would have ensured BR
delivered full spec APT and the upgraded infrastructure to run it on!!

Over the last couple of weeks I have been asked about how to construct
the extra vehicles for the Hornby model - perhaps Chris Shutt, Alan
Weeks or Steve Jones (or anyone else) would like to document the
operation and I'll post it on the www.apt-p.com website.

Thanks in advance...


Rob
www.apt-p.com

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From another group...

Nick

--
Begin forwarded message:

> I (Neil Dimmer) have also added a collection of photos of the APT
> (courtesy of Keith Till)
> at www.electric-photos.fotopic.net/c1235125.html

With my 3 sets of 10 car 370's, after looking at
http://railexpressmodeller.wordpress.com/2007/03/20/hornby-
pendolino/#more-52, this had led me to speculate that maybe there may
be a way to utilise the bogie units for the application of the missing
original hornby coaches for the APT-P.

I would be interested to hear from anyother like-minded member, and
heard a BUZZ that someone was looking at the intermediate coaching
stock to make up a completed set of say 2 x 12 or 2 x 14.

Cheerz Fae Pompey (Portsmouth)

Polmadie-Boy 66A. (Jack Russell)

Hi All

I have just received a query about the development and building costs
of APT-P and wondered if anyone here knows of a primary source of info
about this (perhaps someone has done a search at the Records Office at
Kew - Natalie ??) or failing that any books that cover this (I'm away
from my bookshelf at present !).

Thanks in advance.


Rob
www.apt-p.com

As I recall (and I'm not a primary source) the Budget was £20M, and BR
investment rules allow +/- 10%, plus indexed inflation during the life of
the project.

APT-P was one of the first projects of its kind to be properly monitored
financially, with all the knock-on costs (staff, depot refurbishment etc)
included.

David Boocock kept a firm grip on every aspect of the money, requiring all
expenses to be reported to him using his Cost Codes. (Didn't always win
that: as I recall BR Computing managed to retain their Cost Codes.)
And this was before the days of spreadsheets and calculators, at least to
start with.

So there should be some archive material around.

David 1/2d

----- Original Message -----
From: "Rob Latham" <rob@...>
To: <Advanced-Passenger-Train@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 10:00 AM
Subject: <APT Group> APT-P Costs


> Hi All
>
> I have just received a query about the development and building costs
> of APT-P and wondered if anyone here knows of a primary source of info
> about this (perhaps someone has done a search at the Records Office at
> Kew - Natalie ??) or failing that any books that cover this (I'm away
> from my bookshelf at present !).
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
>
> Rob
> www.apt-p.com
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>





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Database version: 5.06980
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Not specifically P train but Potter states that from 1967 to 1982, the APT project cost £47
million.

Simon

--- In Advanced-Passenger-Train@yahoogroups.com, "David Halfpenny"
<tuppenced@...> wrote:

>
> As I recall (and I'm not a primary source) the Budget was £20M, and BR
> investment rules allow +/- 10%, plus indexed inflation during the life of
> the project.
>
> APT-P was one of the first projects of its kind to be properly monitored
> financially, with all the knock-on costs (staff, depot refurbishment etc)
> included.
>
> David Boocock kept a firm grip on every aspect of the money, requiring all
> expenses to be reported to him using his Cost Codes. (Didn't always win
> that: as I recall BR Computing managed to retain their Cost Codes.)
> And this was before the days of spreadsheets and calculators, at least to
> start with.
>
> So there should be some archive material around.
>
> David 1/2d
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Rob Latham" <rob@...>
> To: <Advanced-Passenger-Train@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 10:00 AM
> Subject: <APT Group> APT-P Costs
>
>
> > Hi All
> >
> > I have just received a query about the development and building costs
> > of APT-P and wondered if anyone here knows of a primary source of info
> > about this (perhaps someone has done a search at the Records Office at
> > Kew - Natalie ??) or failing that any books that cover this (I'm away
> > from my bookshelf at present !).
> >
> > Thanks in advance.
> >
> >
> > Rob
> > www.apt-p.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
> E-mail message checked by PC Tools Spyware Doctor (5.0.0.174)
> Database version: 5.06980
> http://www.pctools.com/spyware-doctor/
>